tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5596708332568087278.post7409375628320195270..comments2024-01-24T10:39:27.668-05:00Comments on Coming Untrue: What Does Your Proof Text Prove? (9)Dr. S. L. Andersonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06303707167715370504noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5596708332568087278.post-40463369198592022432018-04-30T11:13:13.653-04:002018-04-30T11:13:13.653-04:00Excellent points, Bill. Thank you for taking the t...Excellent points, Bill. Thank you for taking the time to comment.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00346761712248157930noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5596708332568087278.post-21075050534783757242018-04-30T10:55:24.203-04:002018-04-30T10:55:24.203-04:00'from the Calvinist standpoint, there is no qu...'from the Calvinist standpoint, there is no question of the elect obtaining salvation'. Does this apply only to Calvinists? However, one understands 'the elect' is it possible for one who is elect not to obtain salvation?<br /><br />'One thing I really like about Rieske’s point of view is that he sees the “elect” as a group, rather than speaking about individual “election” (or the lack thereof).' But the word 'elect' in 2 Tim 2:10 is not singular but plural, as is invariably the case eg. Mt 24:22,24,31; Mk 13:21,22,27; Lk 18:7; Rom 8:33; Col 3:12; Tit 1:1; 1 Pet 1:2. When the singular is used it refers not to a group but to an individual (Rom 16:13) and possibly 2Jn 1,13 (although this may refer to the church). A different word also translated 'election' or 'elect' is found in the singular in Rom 11:7 but even there it seems to point to a collection of individuals since the verse goes on the say that 'the rest (plural) were hardened. <br /><br />'The following verse indicates that the Gentiles are the elect but have not yet obtained salvation. Paul is hopeful that they may obtain salvation, but the wording shows the possibility they may not.' Does the verse necessarily imply uncertainty? If indeed God has His elect and preaching is God's appointed means whereby they might come to salvation, does it not make senses that one would desire to cooperate with God in what He desired to do, even if it involved suffering. A case in point is where the Lord tells Paul not to be afraid in Corinth but to speak because 'I am with you,and no one will attack you to hurt you, for I have many people in this city' (Acts 18:9-10). The fact that He had many people in the city was an incentive to preach, not a deterrent.<br /><br />Bill Yuillehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298118090576956730noreply@blogger.com